hey guys I'm froggy and we have the man
who needs no introduction Justin with us
thanks for being with us Justin happy to
be
here all right so uh we're just gonna
get right into it if that's okay with
you it sounds great let's do it all
right now that you've been uh both a
hunter and we heard all about that on
the documentary and a Hider what's more
exciting for
you well that's a great question you
know I I spent 10 years looking for
Forest treasure I enjoyed every minute
of it and and even before Forest
treasure there was other treasure hunts
that I was involved with to a certain
degrees not that I ever found anything
but uh but you know it's a very
different perspective I think what I
like most about this is I'm able to
incorporate all the things that I think
would be great in a treasure hunt into
what I created so if I were to go out
and look for a treasure this is what I
would want uh and I hope other people do
too that's awesome um
I'll say this as uh so now that you've
done your your time as a hunter and a uh
a Hider if you go back to doing more
treasure hunts looking for stuff do you
feel like you can think a little bit
differently get in the mind of a Creator
a little bit
easier uh I think that's probably true
you know it's like anytime I would do
treasure hunt light forests uh there was
so much time spent in trying to get in
his mindset and understand you know
where he would hide something why he
would hide it there uh and to try and
piece that together so yeah I don't know
if that quite answers your question but
uh yeah no it does it does
yeah right on um oh here's a question um
as you're creating the treasure hunts um
how do you balance difficulty are you
trying to make it just as hard as
possible or are you leaving like I'll
put a little bit of lwh hanging stuff
for someone to grab if you're able to
speak on that at all you know I I think
anybody could create an impossible
treasure hunt like they could go out
somewhere you know bury something or
hide something super well and have such
obscure clues that it would just never
be found right I actually think that's
easier to do um and so I think the right
balance is how do you create something
especially in a vacuum where you can't
talk to anybody else you do this all
kind of all in your mind uh how do you
ensure that it's approachable uh but you
know still challenging uh but but
something that can actually be found
that's been my big challenge uh so I I
hope I've done it justice I really don't
know how long it's going to take it
could be over here I don't know today it
could be another week I I really don't
know how long it's going to take um I
don't have any expectations around the
length of the hunt but um I've designed
it in a way where you know there are
some easier things to find that will
help help you and then there's also some
things that are a little bit more
challenging to discover as well so I
like to kind of think that that'll roll
out in in stages but I mean someone
could just mow through it in no time
also I just I don't
know thank you thank you for answering
that um let's see uh oh so this is a big
one that's publicly uh your big treasure
hunt have you made any smaller hunts
like uh for friends and family have you
done something in the past uh maybe even
all the way back to when you were a kid
with your brother did you ever hide
stuff around for him to
fine you know I I enjoyed treasure
hunting so much when I was a kid I would
hide things for myself to find and I get
out of here look back on that like that
wasn't probably the brightest idea but
uh you know it's just like the act of
Discovery and so my my actually I think
I talk about this in my book a little
bit but my mom got me this basically
this Treasure Hunt game and had these
Scrolls that you'd hide around the house
and it would lead you around to uh to
different locations and uh I would just
go and hide them uh and then my friends
would come over and we do it together
but I just kind of like be in the
backdrop watching so I guess that's
probably close to uh close to what
you're describing as as as what I got
but it was uh it was a fun experience
well and I do remember the chapter we
talking about like obviously Christmas
gifts and I think that's something that
that's probably most people's earliest
Recollections of a treasure hunt like
Christmas looking for where your parents
put the put the gifts at y
absolutely okay here's a fun one uh can
we talk about Victoria
Peak we can what would you like to know
about Victoria Peak so that that chapter
really I mean man the spunk of a kid to
sneak onto a military base and uh try to
get a tour and sneak off that's
wild well it wasn't my probably my most
Shining Moment but uh uh it was uh it
was just enthralling when I was a kid I
mean I just I remember distinctly the
first time I heard about it and all the
years that transpired after that and
just everything that went down and going
to the you know the the OS Family
Partnership convention meeting in in uh
bo I think that was in Albuquerque uh it
was I I couldn't think of a more
exciting way to grow up around something
like that so it it it just absolutely
captured my heart and I think that's in
part maybe why I decided to do this
Treasure Hunt is I remember that feeling
from my youth and I hope there are other
people out there that can get get that
same feeling from what I put together
not to say that it compares to Victorio
peak in any way but it's something well
have you uh so has have you moved on
with your heart have you laid it to rest
or do you still have plans maybe to get
back there do you still think there's
something there to be
found uh I'm not short on ideas um okay
mention this at some point you know
uh I like to believe that there are
alternate entrances to that Cavern I
think there's enough evidence to suggest
it only makes sense for a big cavern
like that to have multiple yeah yeah uh
and so I've been working on another side
project I shelved it for a little while
because I was doing this treasure hunt
thing right uh but uh I like to think
that there are other entrances and the
way to discover those might be through
uh bats you know each evening uh bats
leave their uh their shelter which can
be a cave in search of food and I
actually got this idea when I was a kid
because my parents took me to Carl's bag
caverns in New Mexico and it was right
at nightfall and my dad brought an
umbrella and I thought this is so
ridiculous like what it was there's not
a cloud in the sky and I was embarrassed
that he was bringing this umbrella like
Dad what are you doing you know and so
as Nightfall approached he opens his
umbrella and he's holding it there and I
was just mortified at the time and then
it was just like an explosion of bats
coming out of the cave and of course
with bats come guano and it just kind of
rained down you know and he had the
umbrella it's like wow okay that's
pretty legit uh but my point is how this
relates to the story is um you know if
you look on Doppler radar you actually
will see anomalies at night and there
are large bat colonies that are coming
out of caves and so they're for weather
but you can actually use them to see
uh large cave systems and so I thought
if I could design something that's more
localized that you could say mount on a
truck or a vehicle and you can take it
from location to location it's more
sensitive but has a smaller range uh
maybe at night you could actually detect
uh some sort of small colony of bats
exiting a Cave System you know that
might technically be off off off of the
uh the range boundary of you know the
White Sands Missile Range and maybe you
could find something there I don't know
the Beast uh the Beast version three or
four will have the radar on there well
funny enough I actually sold the Beast
uh no you you let go of the Beast I did
um I did
actually yeah I mean just after uh you
know after Tucker passed I just I
couldn't I couldn't get in that truck
anymore without just seeing him there
and it just killed me uh so anyhow I I
ended up selling it to a really good guy
so okay it's gone to a good home it's G
to a good home well I look forward to uh
staying close to your socials uh as the
years go by and seeing if we can see
something posted about Victoria Peak
that'll be that'll be cool coming up
another
adventure all right uh now that we're
talking about the book uh I've got a few
questions on certain stories in the book
you mind if we go into some of those not
at all let's do it all right uh okay the
first one for me raccoons have you ever
thought about owning a raccoon seriously
since that
day well I actually had a pet raccoon I
don't think I mentioned that in the book
um yeah kind of a crazy story I don't
know when I was a kid just I was
sleeping one night and my dad woke me up
and um said let's go and I didn't know
where we were going you know and my my
brother and I and we we hopped on our
bikes there in in 49ers Country Club in
Tucson and he took us to this location
at the edge of the tree line and um
there were apparently some baby raccoons
that he knew of and he decided to is
going to get one I can't really talk
about the ethics of that that's not I
mean that's debatable but uh he ended up
uh getting two baby raccoons and they
came home to live with us and we
actually raised them so uh I did have
one that's awesome man what what was the
name you remember uh Rascal Rascal I
mean there's not
a have you ever read the book Where the
Red Fern
Grows I have
that's uh that's always uh whenever I
think of raccoons I always think that
was one of the I read it at an early age
and had a really big impact on me yeah
sometimes when I think of Tucker I I
picture a blood hound like uh H yeah I
think there is a bit of a resemblance
there of course Disney did the the movie
as well but I always preer the
book uh okay here we go um when you
drive today uh and if you can't say
because there might be law enforcement
watching do you still use the
speedometer or do you trust your uh m
marker method well I think it's
something ingrained in me by now so I do
find myself on the highway from time to
time you know checking the mile markers
in the mile post so uh yeah it
happens here's another one uh this was
another one of my top stories from the
book The uh your uh your gift was it
called Posey's Revenge at the gift uh
store where you the scents from all the
candles got you are you still sensitive
do you have a lot of candles in your
house right now no you know it's funny
there's
there's a very distinctive smell from
that candle and every once in probably
like five years I'll catch a whiff of it
and I immediately get nauseous and I've
just gota like run from the area uh I
don't know what the smell or the scent
is but it's uh it doesn't agree with my
body for some
reason all right note to self candles is
Kryptonite all right we got that
down um all right speaking of another
incident here um in the story where you
uh were you and Tucker which thankfully
he was okay uh but where you got hit by
the bike uh in bellw in the Seattle area
what happened with that did you uh did
you ever find out who did it did it were
there bystanders that watched it or you
remember no you know it happened near
Nightfall and uh you know it was was
over as quickly as it began uh it was
you know through and through a hit and
run we never never figured out who that
was you know I think back then there
maybe today people would have like ring
doorbell cameras or something it might
have caught something like that but not
back then yeah do you still uh bike bike
a lot a decent amount I do I mean not
nearly as much as I used to um I'm
mainly more into hiking and you know
backpacking and fishing and that that
sort of thing these days but uh uh from
time to time okay oh the next one we can
go to fishing um all right so you
mentioned a lot about uh fly fishing
have you ever been offsh
fishing I have uh a number of times and
it's almost never been a good ending for
me I get no violently seasick
unfortunately okay you know yeah I think
a few times off the coast of Hawaii and
then uh off the coast of Oregon a few
times and also down in in Mexico as well
uh and each time it just it gets
me so so fly fishing you know you're on
your own two feet it's a little bit more
stable that's that's kind of a thing oh
yeah certainly yeah I mean there was one
particular incident at see where um this
was actually off the coast of Hawaii my
dad had just caught some uh Ono fish and
on board it was just horrible to me at
the time like they're they're cutting
off pieces of this fish and eating it
raw on the boat I mean the fish is
basically still moving uh instant throw
up like I
just that situation no I I much prefer
Inland fishing especially trout
fishing trout fish okay trout that
that's your that's your your go-to fish
trout it is yes yeah one one one time in
my youth I fancied myself a bass
fisherman but I think the net result of
that is that it's not for me I'm more of
a trout guy so I'm I'm very uh uh
ignorant to tr to fly fishing I've never
been fly fishing I've been offshore once
or twice I've I've done I guess the
traditional reel a couple times fly
fishing to me just seems really
complicated it just I don't know it just
it seems really tough I think it
partially depends on what you kind of
grew up with you know it's like you try
and learn say skiing as an adult versus
you know you see the little kids zipping
up into the mountain or down the
mountain all the time and you know I
think some things are just kind of
easier to pick up at a younger age uh
but I think often times I mean there are
Advanced techn technicalities and
technical issues with with fly fishing
but you know the basics of it is really
not not that bad I think it is pretty
approachable but I can imagine how it
can be frustrating for someone just
starting out I think it just takes the
right guidance that's
all is there a story with a a bass that
got away for a reason why you want to
stick the trout or it just came up empty
a couple times no when I was a kid we
went to Table Rock Lake in Missouri okay
and I was so excited about it uh because
we were going to go bass fishing for the
first time and of course I had read like
30 books on bass fishing and I felt like
oh I'm just bash bass fishing
extraordinaire like it's gonna go
awesome uh and so the uh the the morning
of my dad overslept and I was just
beside myself and I came in and of
course I was balling my eyes out you
know I was probably like I don't know
nine or 10 at the time I'm not sure and
he felt terrible so he jumped up he's
like no no we're going bass fishing so
uh you know we went out on the boat and
we spent all day uh and actually we were
with my uh one of my uncles who is a um
actually a competitive bass
fisherman and we didn't get a single
bite the whole day you
know I don't know just that that first
experience for whatever reason just kind
of turned me off I I'm probably the
world's worst Fass
fisherman all right we'll stick in the
trout then uh okay here's here's another
big one hard-hitting question right here
uh the story about the uh the beino
Betrayal why did you eat all the beino
why not just dump out the
pills well you know
it's the genius of Youth um I had it in
my mind that I needed to take I should
take the pills because you know I didn't
want any sort of uh flatulence issues
later on in the evening so it's like
that's what this is for like God you
know it was one's good a handful is
better yeah so exactly it was just just
like more of anything must be better
which clearly is not the
case yeah I I cracked up that and from
the Discord channels that's that's a fan
favorite is that one oh boy yeah just so
you know people enjoy the uh the imagery
of you bending over in pain so that's
fan favorite you know I do what I
can all right uh so this one um this
one's more probably me than the
community that wants to know I I'm uh I
served in the military I really related
or really found the story of your your
grandpa Wayne interesting especially uh
you know the the stories you were
telling um about his time in the big red
one uh and then the wild thing about him
crossing the ring cones with just like a
knife and a canteen like are there so
you do talk a little bit about him and a
little bit about that are there any
stories that you remember that he told
you that you can share with us here um
any either either in the War uh you know
serving in that unit or crossing the
ring cones like any stories he told
about that
yeah well first off thank you for your
service I didn't I didn't realize you've
been part of the military so that's very
cool um yeah there's a lot of stories uh
you know most of them were from the time
that he was a fishing game warden in
fact actually I think I mentioned it
maybe in the book uh you you do you do a
couple times yeah he wrote his own
Memoir and that is uh boy what is that
called uh where in the hell did you come
from it's the ups and downs and in and
outs of of of being a game warden uh and
there I think there's some pretty pretty
incredible stories in there and some of
them uh you know he has a kind of a very
matter of fact
storytelling way about him so uh you
know I I knew him well and I even
struggled through that
book uh just because it's I think a
little little dry reading if you if you
will but um yeah I mean there's some
pretty incredible stories like when he
was a fishing game Mor he was uh this
was in Southwestern Montana and he was
overlooking this this Ridge through
binoculars watching some some fly
fishermen I think down in the valley
either that or some some Hunters I don't
I don't recall which and his uh he
bumped the the manual shift lever in his
vehicle while he was there and he didn't
notice it because he's looking through
these binoculars so the uh the Jeep
started slowly rolling forward and it
went over the embankment and uh down the
mountain side and of course the the
binoculars were around his a strap
around his neck and they just beat him
to hell as the oh my God you know as the
vehicle tumbled down to the bottom and I
think he was stuck down there for quite
a while uh and at some point just I mean
we're talking the middle of nowhere uh
just Serendipity that some uh somebody
was driving by and they happened to
notice the tire tracks going off the off
the road and they stopped and uh looked
down there and he hollered up to them
and it's the only reason I think he
survived that incident but there's a lot
of actually stories like that in that
book um you know at some point I think I
i' I've considered doing a a revised
Edition uh to kind of tighten it up and
and focus on some of the more
interesting stuff but yeah there's a lot
there okay I think yeah I think I'll
have to check that out someone did uh
post a link to that earlier we were
digging into it you know as as the
community does digging into things right
um are there any plans so you mentioned
about the revised Edition possibly but
do you have any plans to do um like a
part two to uh you know beond the map's
Edge or like
another what would you call it like an
inary book or
something yeah it's funny my neighbor um
keeps telling me I need to do a u the
unedited version of of Beyond map Edge
but I think that might be a little too
politically un incorrect I'm sure there
was some stuff that you know your editor
had to figle a little bit of ch a little
bit oh well the editor I mean Matt
really saved saved that book it was a
deplorable mess before he got involved I
I have a penchant for uh similes and and
metaphors and uh a little bit of
literary flourish if you will uh taken
to the extreme so I appreciate that he
was able to kind of Co the herd there a
little bit but uh yeah I mean I I don't
think I'm the world's most proficient Au
author so I I I think I'd be loathed to
to try and create something else so I
probably not but stranger things have
happened well hey people enjoy it from
what from what I mean I agree it's a
pretty easy read um so whether you or
the editor both you guys can take credit
for both that together it's uh it's a
pretty easy read well hey and if you
don't enjoy it you get uh you get some
kindling I might have cost you 40
something dollars
but uh okay uh so a couple more
questions here because we're getting to
the end of things um looking back uh
looking back on this whole experience so
far we're still early into it but
looking back on your uh 90,000 journey
to hide stuff with a broken tibia
looking back on the puzzles and all the
effort you put into that is there which
are you more proud of your the final
spot that you decided or the puzzle
itself
wow if you were to sit back and think
like you know what like that spot is
just the best spot or this puzzle so you
know well crafted like is there one that
takes precedence one of the
other I think I'm equally pleased with
both equally great spot and a great
puzzle yeah um I think they're
both yeah I'm I'm I'm I'm pretty happy
with both okay I'm good I'm I'm I'm
hoping somebody uh hopefully it doesn't
go decades I don't want it to be found
too soon I I want to I I enjoy the
buildup I enjoy this uh the suspense and
everything so there's any correlation
between how long it takes for someone to
craft a puzzle versus how long it takes
someone to solve it you you might be in
luck I I think Forest spent like what
did he say 10 years working on poem yeah
I came up with the bulk of that poem in
about four to six hours
so uh you know uh I don't know if that
comparison helps anybody but
well I wrote that down in a marker CED
it and uh if I had a soundboard that
would be a soundboard
[Laughter]
section uh okay um as of a short
question right here as of today this
very moment would you do it all over
again if you go back to the start still
still enjoying the process I am you know
there's there's been
some uh some speed bumps along the way
you know I really I I was happy to to
write the book I'm not not as uh I
really didn't want to be in a position
of actually selling it it's like you
know go to Barnes & Noble or your local
bookstore or something like that I just
think with some of the supply chain
challenges you know having to you give
give people an Avenue to purchase until
that gets resolved has been uh a little
bit of a a pain point for me but um I'm
happy to do it like it's it needed to be
done so uh you know beyond that I think
actually things have been running uh
very smoothly so far of course it's
early so not going to would but uh I'm
very
hopeful okay and the last question here
is um let's talk for a few seconds about
uh what does the future hold for Mr
posie for for Justin I mean um are there
any more Netflix documentaries on the
road for anything else you allowed to
say that no there's nothing in the
pipeline um you know I I really do see
myself transitioning to just being a
bystander uh I feel like I've said
everything I want to say I think that
the announcements that have gone up have
given a good round of initial Clarity I
don't plan to do a lot of you know
interviews or anything like that uh it's
more just it's out there you know enjoy
it while it lasts and and and have a
good time uh you know I think there's a
few people that had reached out early
that had asked uh to do an interview and
uh yourself included which I'm I'm happy
to
oblige yeah I think after this initial
round my uh my my time in the spotlight
is over just you know go and have a good
time all right so no plans for you know
Good Morning America you know Inside
Edition Justin on the spotlight uh not
yet not at this moment no there's no
plans for anything like that I mean if
there's some sort of media outlet that
wants to you know collaborate on
something that I think would be
genuinely
useful uh I can't imagine what that
would be offand I'm certainly not
opposed to it but generally speaking
I've said what I want to say yeah I can
see how it would get kind of uh tiring
to hear this same five questions by
everybody where's it at is it here can
you tell us you have to oh no yeah it's
it's not that I'm you know and I I think
more anything it's what's important is
that all the information is kind of in
one place and I feel like the more
interviews that happen uh the more risk
there is for that information to kind of
just spread out all over the place it
just makes it harder I think you know
just me being in the shoes of a a
Searcher for so long it's hard to keep
on top of all that it's like oh well he
said this over there and said that over
there I think at some point someone uh
in the forest Fen Chase had created a a
word uh well it was some sort of
document that you could pay for and it
was all of the words from forest Fen
from like a multitude of interviews and
just different sources and it was great
to have all that together but the mere
fact that someone had to create that I
think is kind of problem atic so uh I I
prefer to avoid that all right well hey
thank you for your time and if anybody
uh you want to know his website is
really great uh treasure. Quest and uh
like he said he puts all the information
right there um thank you Justin for
coming on well thank you froggy
appreciate your time all
right all around for blunder do you need
some help to be your
best there's something that you're
trying to find but you're about to lose
your mind so come on listen in est's
quest day is Quest the show where he'll
be sharing Clues day is Quest will chase
away your Searchers Clues he solving
puzzles with a smile he'll help your
theories pass the trial he's welcoming
you here to be his
guest now listen close and you'll be
told the clues to every High to go so
come on listen in to este's
Quest come on listen in to EST
[Applause]
[Music]